IP-WARS.NET - a forward command post of the IP Wars
create account| Front Page|Mission|Standard Operating Procedures|Operating Instructions(aka FAQ's)|Privacy Policy|Site Stats/Info|Admin Actions|Search
Sections:General|IP|SCO v World |Microsoft|grok*/OSRM|IPW Site Meta|Logbooks|Diaries|Legal Documents|View All Articles
Display: Sort:
SS IPW Takes A Hit | 97 comments (97 topical, 0 editorial, 2 hidden)
Re: out for the count? (4.90 / 10) (#94)
by JCausey (jcausey@ip-wars.net) on Mon Sep 12th, 2005 at 09:42:02 EST
(User Info) http://www.ip-wars.net
Well, first of all, thanks to everyone who has been posting in this thread.  I've been so despondant over all this, I have not even wanted to get on the 'net over the weekend.  Reading what I have read here has changed that.

And my thanks goes not only to those who have supported my decision, but those who have been critical as well.  I do have to say that the criticisms strike home with me as I think they are the type of issues that made me so sick at what I did.  The threat (nee elimination?) to the possibility of free speech on this site.  The integrity of the site.  The breach it has created for future actions against the site.  And I very much considered taking the site down completely.

That said, having read some of the comments here has helped me to clear my head a bit and start the natural analysis that I tend to do (and once again demonstrates the "many eyeballs" strength of the open source method as many here have identified issues I never would have seen on my own).  First, I look back at the history of the site a bit.  As some have commented, the specific effort to CCL everything here is unusual (not sure we are the first or only doing it, but I have to guess we are out in front with it).  That was a conscious decision to help protect against this site going down.  It was also a result of everyone here debating the issues and providing their input.

We have also had extensive discussion here about policies to help protect against other potential threats.  The site has a history of debate about what measures need to be put in place to help protect it.  We now have this unfortunate incident where we did not anticipate this particular type of attack and had no plan of action.  But that does not mean we can't make the necessary changes needed to withstand the next attack.  In fact, I'm heartened to see many of the contributors here already starting on that.

To go back to the "war" metaphors, when you are on the front lines, you have to expect to take some casualties.  When that happens, you can't turn tail and run.  Instead, you figure out how to continue the fight in spite of the casualties you've suffered.  Certainly, some may think what has happened is a fatal blow.  imo, while a nasty hit, it does not have to be fatal.

Or, to turn to a sports metaphor, you can't expect to shut out the other side every game, sometimes you'll even find yourself down, but as long as there is time on the clock, you keep playing in an effort to come back.

So yes, I have been knocked down and bloodied (and everyone who has contributed to the site as well).  But now I'm standing up, spitting the blood out of my mouth, knocking some dust off, and getting myself braced for the next round.  Hopefully, everyone here will do the same.

With all that said, I would like to add some input to help with this process of fortifying our position.  The first thing that I have realized is the EFF and some of the other folks I contacted are severely limited in what they can do.  In fact, I'd say they are really only able to handle potential "precedent" setting cases.  This means the average blogger or forum owner who gets hit with a nuisance suit is on their own.  I'm not sure what the solution is - a legal fund established ahead of time?  hope someone creates a product that individuals could afford to help protect themselves?  setup some kind of cooperative or association to spread costs?  Whatever the solution, something needs to be done to ensure that not only the wealthy are able to avail themselves of the power of free speech and the Internet (alas, this disparity between rich and poor exists in meatspace as well).

In this situation, a human element was introduced that affected the outcome as well.  We never know when someone who is willing to fight may get hit with other stuff at the same time that negates that willingness or ability to fight.  And the threats are not only legal in nature.  Quite frankly, I could drop dead tomorrow and the site would probably go down.  This all leads me to the model of the Internet where it was designed to withstand weaknesses or breaks and can basically, route itself around problems.  Perhaps more needs to be done to ensure that the flow of information on sites like this can continue even when a site goes down.  More mirrors needed?  More aggressive recruitment of mirrors?  Some type of multiple ownership to help harden each site?

And at this site, we now see some specific issues for me to address.  Does the site need to be transferred to someone else?  A corporation setup to own the site?

As you can see, there are multiple levels that need to be addressed and there will be interaction between them.  I would suggest one goal would be to design some solutions that provide a disincentive to people who want to shut down sites via the court system.  I'm sure other goals need to be set as well.

Already, there are members of this site who have started work on these issues and I'm thankful for that as their knowledge and input has proven invaluable in the past.  I invite everyone to join in that effort.

Thanks,

Jeff

  • Re: out for the count? by mikey, 09/12/2005 11:11:10 EST (4.44 / 9)

SS IPW Takes A Hit | 97 comments (97 topical, 0 editorial, 2 hidden)
Display: Sort:

Links

Firefox 2

Use OpenOffice.org

Add to Technorati Favorites

Join EFF Today

ToTehMoon web site button

~ Merkey v The Internet et al Docs
~ Yahoeuvre
~ tuxrocks.com (SCO cases legal docs)
~ scofacts.org
~ eagle.petrofsky.org
~ Zen's Den
~ Yahoo SCOX Message Board
~ Lamlaw
~ Microsoft Watch
~ Groklaw
~ Korgwal - a Groklaw mirror
~ nosoftwarepatents.com
~ Flame Warriors
~ SCOXE Wars
~ Get your Merkey Number here!
~ Digital Law Online

Recent Comments

Breaking News and External Article Comments
General News – General Articles
by ColonelZen, January 5
60 comments
» SCO Lifeboat List from Stats_for_all – AncientBrit, May 6
» Not a single comment on the Novell... – sphealey, Jul 22
» Re: Not a single comment on the Novell... – AncientBrit, Aug 8

Eagle Loses Appeals
General News – General Articles
by JCausey, December 15
1 comment
» Re: Eagle Loses Appeals – br3n, Jan 7

The Chinese Room Revisited, Thoughts on...
General News – Diary
by ColonelZen, November 24
1 comment
» Re: The Chinese Room Revisited,... – ColonelZen, Nov 24

How to Transition a Windows Shop to Linux
General News – General Articles
by JCausey, November 21
3 comments
» Re: How to Transition a Windows Shop to... – ColonelZen, Nov 22
» Re: How to Transition a Windows Shop to... – JCausey, Nov 23
» Re: How to Transition a Windows Shop to... – ColonelZen, Nov 23

Advocacy
General News – Diary
by br3n, October 29
3 comments
» Re: Advocacy – br3n, Nov 2
» Re: Advocacy – ColonelZen, Nov 2
» Re: Advocacy – br3n, Nov 4

Very Bad News for Darl and Ralph
SCO v The World – Diary
by ColonelZen, October 13
7 comments
» Re: OT advocacy – br3n, Oct 26
» Re: OT advocacy – JCausey, Oct 28
» Re: OT advocacy – br3n, Oct 29

Some SCOX Financial Analysis
SCO v The World – SCO Related Articles
by JCausey, September 21
13 comments
» Re: Some SCOX Financial Analysis – br3n, Oct 3
» Re: Some SCOX Financial Analysis – ColonelZen, Oct 3
» Re: Some SCOX Financial Analysis – br3n, Oct 6

Open Source in Education - Opening Doors
General News – General Articles
by JCausey, September 28
1 comment
» Re: Open Source in Education - Opening... – br3n, Sep 29

An IPOWER ful experience
General News – Diary
by ColonelZen, September 25
6 comments
» IPOWER SysAdmin Doesn't Do Weekends!! – ColonelZen, Sep 29
» Re: An IPOWER ful experience – ColonelZen, Sep 29
» Re: An IPOWER ful experience – ColonelZen, Sep 29

Learning C#
Microsoft – Diary
by ColonelZen, September 23
1 comment
» Re: Learning C# – ColonelZen, Sep 23

Comment search...

Recent Diaries

SCO has a Potential and Credible BILLION Dollar Liability
by ColonelZen - March 15

The Chinese Room Revisited, Thoughts on Consciousness
by ColonelZen - November 24
1 comment


Advocacy
by br3n - October 29
3 comments


An IPOWER ful experience
by ColonelZen - September 25
6 comments


Learning C#
by ColonelZen - September 23
1 comment


Getting ruby DBI for Mysql and Postgresql working on FC 6
by ColonelZen - March 7

Declaration of Linus Torvalds
by nedu - February 13
1 comment


Declaration of M. Douglas McIlroy
by nedu - February 12
6 comments


Declaration of Ulrich Drepper
by nedu - February 11
1 comment


Declaration of K. Y. Srinivasan
by nedu - February 11


More Diaries...

Login

Make a new account

Username:
Password:

SourceForge Logo Powered by Scoop

All trademarks and copyrights on this page are owned by their respective companies or owners.
Comments, articles and logbooks are owned by the Poster. By posting on the ip-wars.net web site, all posters grant a license to ip-wars.net to publish the content and release it pursuant to the Creative Commons License that covers the rest of the site. For more details, please check out the Standard Operating Procedures. Also, please read the Privacy Policy for the site. Finally, DO NOT send e-mail to the site owner (Jeff Causey) unless you have read and agree to the terms regarding e-mail included in the Standard Operating Procedures.
Everything else © 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 ip-wars.net and Jeffrey G. Causey and is licensed under a
Creative Commons License
This work is licensed under a Creative Commons License.