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CMS Heavy


General News

By heimdal31, Section Diary
Posted on Tue Jul 12th, 2005 at 20:36:17 EST

As a followup to Sunny's CMS-Lite diary entry, I'm trying to set up a more robust CMS for work.  I'm hoping I can get some pointers.

At work about a year and a half ago, we put in a CMS system.  It was a Java app running on Tomcat writtem by some outside consultants.  At the time, I argued against it saying that we could do better with an open source solution.  I was voted down because at the time we had no open source solutions in house and the outside consultants argued that we would have full rights to their java code and could alter it just as easily as we could open source.

Of course, my concern was more in terms of support issues and getting locked into a single vendor.

Well, their system worked, but the interface was clunky, bug reports were all but ignored and while it had a templating sytem, it was easier to pay them to create templates than to try to do it yourself--and it was setting on top of a fully F/OSS stack of apps and glue.  Well, fast-forward a year and a half when we have a number of F/OSS products in production use and I'm sitting down across from my boss in my annual review.

After going through my stuff, he asked for constructive criticism of his performance.  He's an old mainframe coder, so he is actually a great manager.  He still prefers to get his hands dirty, and while he doesn't really write code any more, he understands the process.  He also takes bullets for the team.  There really was very little to complain about.  So, as I was searching for something more than an ass-kissing, "you're doing great," my mind wondered back to our less than ideal CMS system.

I suggested that he made the wrong decision and that the one I had liked back then had progressed quite a bit and the consultants version had basically stood still and actually caused the very people we wanted to use it to avoid it.  My thoughts in suggesting this were along the lines of "pay more attention to my opinion next time."  Unfortunately, he is actually a good manager, so he said, "Great.  If you can get a site up and running, we'll switch over."

So, I'm not so much looking for advice on a system.  Though, if you disagree with my choice feel free to speak up.  I'm more looking for pointers and a solution to a specific problem.

What I've settled on is Plone.  I like the interface. I like the development progress.  I like the flexibility and extensibility.

However, I also like the PloneArticle add-on because it solves a number of requests that the current system makes very difficult.  However, I cannot get it running.

I'm starting with a base CentOS 4.1 system because our production server is RHEL based.  The only plone RPM available for it is an older DAG 2.0.4 based install that I think includes an even older ZOPE.

PloneArticle has some rather more recent pre-reqs.  I have successfully gotten a souce based ZOPE 2.7.5 with Plone 2.0.5.  However, the stock Plone 2.0.5 does not include Archetypes 1.3.1 or greater, nor does it have ATContentTypes at all.  And I've had real problems getting the pre-reqs for them to work.

ArcheTypes is a major reworking of the CMF Zope elements.  Plone is undergoing major re-writes to convert most of the Plone structure to actually be ArcheTypes based.  (I briefly tried Plone 2.1 alpha which has all the PloneArticle pre-reqs, but found that it was definitely alpha.)

I don't currently have access to the box I've been playing with, but my problem comes when trying to get the most recent PortalTransforms working.  Every time I try adding it, Zope fails to start.

I did just notice, in poking around for this diary entry that there is an ArcheTypes package bundled with a different version of PortalTransforms.  I will have to try that tomorrow.  I almost killed the diary entry, but I'm still going to post it for pointers or any other comments.

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CMS Heavy | 9 comments (9 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
Re: CMS Heavy (3.50 / 4) (#1)
by david anderson on Tue Jul 12th, 2005 at 21:47:03 EST
(User Info) http://squtch.quiet-like-a-panther.org/
Damn, it sounds like you lucked out with your manager.

In 25 years of contracting, I only had one that sounds like he would even compared to that. He was also the only one where I considered going permanent for. Unfortuantely the suits decided to go for the big reorg and RIF about that time and he got reassigned as something like an engineering consultant to marketing.

As for the CMS, I prefer have really only used blog and forum software and prefer to hand code content sites for a very important reason - search engines.

Of course, if this is for an intranet, or for existing customers, then that really isn't a concern. But if your goals include getting search engine ranking, then you need to look into what sort of work they have done on that front.

From looking around on the Plone site, it seems like they have at least got the basics down right. Damn, I just noticed that they even have a how-to for automatically doing google sitemaps.

Please keep us (or at least me) updated on how it is going.

  • Initial success by heimdal31, 07/13/2005 14:39:07 EST (3.66 / 3)
    • Re: Initial success by david anderson, 07/13/2005 15:51:17 EST (3.25 / 4)
      • Re: Initial success by heimdal31, 07/13/2005 16:39:40 EST (3.66 / 3)
  • Re: CMS Heavy by Sunny, 07/12/2005 22:57:34 EST (3.00 / 3)
  • Re: CMS Heavy by heimdal31, 07/12/2005 23:11:18 EST (3.00 / 3)
Re: CMS Heavy (3.50 / 4) (#6)
by ColonelZen (tzellers lieth within pobox of thy kingdom com) on Wed Jul 13th, 2005 at 16:00:47 EST
(User Info)

I've been wearing the programmer hat more than the admin hat lately, but my primary client has made noises in the direction of bringing me in f/t to admin their Linux boxes.

Which is to say that despite not "liking" nor personally having uses for CMS systems (I write programs to generate content! I don't need no steenking "system" to tell me where to put it... I'll tell the steenking system where to put it!) I appreciate diaries like this.  If such an issue comes up (very well could, as obviously businesses do have needs and desires for these systems) this would be a good reference point.  

Thx.

-- TWZ


Re: CMS Heavy (none / 2) (#8)
by mikey (mikey at badpenguins dot com) on Fri Jul 15th, 2005 at 12:56:48 EST
(User Info) http://www.ip-wars.net
I looked into plone at one point for the exact same use - an internal CMS.  The GNU site converted to plone and looked really slick.

I found it to be a bloated overblown counter-intuitive piece of junk.

I say that because I come from more of a LAMP background.  Trying to integrate plone into serving requests via apache was a chore.  Dealing with all of the pieces that it requires was a chore.  After I finally got all of the dependencies installed and attempted to start using it, I found the interfaces and methods to configure it unacceptable.  I was looking for something quick, something that could easily be modified/customized, and something that users and other administrators could easily pick up.  I did not get that impression at all.  It seemed cobbled together to me and not intuitive at all.

If I had more time and more experience with zope/python I might consider it.  To me it would be easier to just hack most of the features out of something like postnuke to customze it for our use.


---
DISCLAIMER:
IANAL, may have no idea what the heck I am talking about, yadda yadda yadda.

Bye bye spambot (none / 0) (#9)
by Potential Recruit on Tue Nov 28th, 2006 at 11:17:43 EST
This used to be a spambot post that is flooding the site. Due to volume, I had to resort to this while I work to block access by these bots. My apologies - thanks for your patience.

Jeff

CMS Heavy | 9 comments (9 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
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